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Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

  • 1.  Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-10-2019 07:00
    Serious question.
    Why would someone pay significantly more money for Sage Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    What are some things that Alerts does that Visual Cuts can't? 


    Sage Alerts & Workflow Pricing

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    Wayne Schulz
    Schulz Consulting - Consultant
    Glastonbury CT
    860-516-8990
    http://www.s-consult.com
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  • 2.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-10-2019 07:22
    It's the Alerts part.  It scans your files and can send you an alert when a field changes, i.e. QOH of an item hits the reorder point, a customer hits their credit limit, a PO over a certain dollar amount has been created, etc.

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    Beth Bowers
    269-445-1625
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  • 3.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-10-2019 09:02
    Doesn't Visual Cut have essentially the same capabilities though I'm not certain whether it can be set as real-time? I think you can set VC to run on a pre-determined schedule.

    I'm curious because if Visual Cut at $360 and 20% maintenance can do essentially the same thing for 98% of users then it seems like something we should be pointing out to customers.

    If my math is right then A&W is $99+ ( 3 x $79) + $79 = $415/mo x 12 = $4,980/year
    Visual Cut is $360 with 2 years support and after that 20% or $60/year

    Granted, Visual Cut is a one-man shop so there's some risk there but given the choice, I believe many customers would choose VC and accept the risk

    I seem to mostly run into Alerts and Workflow at existing users and haven't had the opportunity to sell A&W (I have sold one Visual Cut which has been very reliable).

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    Wayne Schulz
    Schulz Consulting - Consultant
    Glastonbury CT
    860-516-8990
    http://www.s-consult.com
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  • 4.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-10-2019 09:08

    I think the main thing is what you want to see and the regularity or opportunity of them happening.  Most of us would like a report of items that have hit their respective order point.  And an alert when a customer order went in at $10,000,000 dollars, either cause for celebration or a mistake!  I certainly feel there is room in the space for both items, and I hope that one-man at VisualCut can get some back up and a vacation!

     

     

    Blytheco-Logo-Signature-Logo.pngPatrick J. Johnston

    Sage 100 Consultant

    www.blytheco.com | 949.583.9500 Ext. 2224

    ERP • CRM • HRMS • MARKETING • FAS

    Business Software & Consulting

     

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    ------Original Message------

    Doesn't Visual Cut have essentially the same capabilities though I'm not certain whether it can be set as real-time? I think you can set VC to run on a pre-determined schedule.

    I'm curious because if Visual Cut at $360 and 20% maintenance can do essentially the same thing for 98% of users then it seems like something we should be pointing out to customers.

    If my math is right then A&W is $99+ ( 3 x $79) + $79 = $415/mo x 12 = $4,980/year
    Visual Cut is $360 with 2 years support and after that 20% or $60/year

    Granted, Visual Cut is a one-man shop so there's some risk there but given the choice, I believe many customers would choose VC and accept the risk

    I seem to mostly run into Alerts and Workflow at existing users and haven't had the opportunity to sell A&W (I have sold one Visual Cut which has been very reliable).

    ------------------------------
    Wayne Schulz
    Schulz Consulting - Consultant
    Glastonbury CT
    860-516-8990
    http://www.s-consult.com
    ------------------------------


  • 5.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-10-2019 09:12
    Also, I believe that Alerts & Workflow (aka Knowledgesync) was purchased by <g class="gr_ gr_65 gr-alert gr_spell gr_inline_cards gr_run_anim ContextualSpelling ins-del multiReplace" id="65" data-gr-id="65">ECi</g> software who also owns Macola and subsequently announced that they'd be eliminating at least some of their Macola channel and reportedly sent letters directly to customers which seemed to suggest that the customer would need to go directly to <g class="gr_ gr_382 gr-alert gr_spell gr_inline_cards gr_run_anim ContextualSpelling ins-del multiReplace" id="382" data-gr-id="382">ECi</g> for Macola professional services.

    As of November <g class="gr_ gr_494 gr-alert gr_gramm gr_inline_cards gr_run_anim Punctuation only-ins replaceWithoutSep" id="494" data-gr-id="494">2018</g> there appeared to be active litigation between some partners and ECi.

    That's not to say that what's going on between <g class="gr_ gr_542 gr-alert gr_spell gr_inline_cards gr_run_anim ContextualSpelling ins-del multiReplace" id="542" data-gr-id="542">ECi</g> and Macola VARS will spread to Knowledgesync but that there could be some risk with A&W just as there is with Visual Cut being a one-man show.

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    Wayne Schulz
    Schulz Consulting - Consultant
    Glastonbury CT
    860-516-8990
    http://www.s-consult.com
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  • 6.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-10-2019 10:57
    There is another option in this discussion.  Tricia Cate, formerly of Vineyardsoft, has reached out to me about a competitive product to SAW.  Fisher Technology has created an alert type software that does what SAW does.  It is called BPA (Business Process Automation Platform).  I have seen a demo and it seems to do everything SAW does and more.  Here is the product page:
    Codeless Platforms | BPA Platform
    Fisher-technology remove preview
    Codeless Platforms | BPA Platform
    The business process automation platform from Codeless platforms is your key to efficiently integrate your business systems and achieve more by doing less.
    View this on Fisher-technology >


    Below is a You Tube video:
    BPA Platform Creating an Alert
    YouTube remove preview
    BPA Platform Creating an Alert
    Watch how easy it is to create an automated alert in less than 10 minutes using Business Process Automation Platform.
    View this on YouTube >


    Trisha can be reached at:  tricia@fisher-technology.com

    Cooper




    ------------------------------
    Cooper Black
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  • 7.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-10-2019 11:04
    Cooper - do you know whether BPA has a packet of ready-made alerts like SAW does?

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    Beth Bowers
    Mom to Samson, Peanut, ChiChi, Canton, and Cagney
    269-445-1625
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  • 8.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-10-2019 11:27

    I think that they do.  Don't quote me on it. 

     



    ------Original Message------

    Cooper - do you know whether BPA has a packet of ready-made alerts like SAW does?

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    Beth Bowers
    Mom to Samson, Peanut, ChiChi, Canton, and Cagney
    269-445-1625
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  • 9.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-10-2019 12:11
    BPA, also known as Task Centre (UK product). When I spoke to Tricia (a few years back) there was no event pack YET, and they were working on a migration of Sage Alerts jobs.
    She said it's "not access 97, like SAW."     A strength it had was eCommerce, like Magento and Shopify.  It also did not write back yet.  Events were sold in bundles of 10.

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    Rhonda McNamara
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  • 10.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-10-2019 12:30
    Just an FYI - we are in a test process to implement BPA Platform (aka Codeless Platform) from Fisher Technologies for ourselves, and we just received a notice that Tricia is no longer employed there.  Bummer - she was our implementation person!

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    Sue Bennett
    President
    Tigard OR
    503.620.3484
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  • 11.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-10-2019 13:44
    Edited by Dan Burleson 01-10-2019 13:46
    I used Alerts a couple of time years ago, but quickly found that it wasn't much more effort to just create a Crystal Reports query and schedule that on the Sage 100 server where it can repeat weekly, daily or hourly. No programming necessary! Using the free version LogiCity (or Vi$ual Cut) and Crystal reports, emails can be sent with PDF output attached only if a result of the query is found. Neither LogiCity nor Visual Cut can send SMS messages, but that hasn't been an issue for any job I've been asked to do. Visual Cut can burst reports, but with LogiCity one can modify the report to accomplish a group based distribution.

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    Dan Burleson
    Software Consultant
    Corvallis OR
    541-224-6642
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  • 12.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-10-2019 17:10
    Edited by Brett Zimmerman 01-10-2019 17:11
    LinkedIn doesn't show where she went.




  • 13.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-10-2019 15:11
    SAW does new / changed record type alerts out of the box... while with Visual Cut you have to handle this manually (I showed how this is done in the VC webinar). 
    For cost effectiveness and ease of use, VC wins 99.99% of the time in my opinion.

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    Kevin Moyes
    Technical Systems Analyst
    ON
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  • 14.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-11-2019 11:46
    I can clarify a few things here about Vineyardsoft, KnowledgeSync, and BPA.

    Two partners started Vsoft; Jim, the tech partner died suddenly last year intestate. That forced the company sale. I do not know how he was replaced. They had enhanced the product quite a bit in the past few years, including the use of <g class="gr_ gr_393 gr-alert gr_gramm gr_inline_cards gr_run_anim Grammar only-ins replaceWithoutSep" id="393" data-gr-id="393">SQL</g> database. Their pricing for the Sage channel is dictated by Sage.

    The husband-wife team that brought the BPA product from <g class="gr_ gr_183 gr-alert gr_gramm gr_inline_cards gr_run_anim Grammar only-ins replaceWithoutSep" id="183" data-gr-id="183">UK</g> to America are still quite active with it. They were quite active in the <g class="gr_ gr_755 gr-alert gr_spell gr_inline_cards gr_run_anim ContextualSpelling ins-del multiReplace" id="755" data-gr-id="755">Saleslogix</g> area, although I never did a deal with them. Nicole Laurier (nicole@fisher-technology.com) is a knowledgeable, responsive, realistic contact. Their product is more complex to use than ksync, and more expensive. However, it is also quite flexible. 

    I hope this helps.

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    Jerry Norman
    CEO, SmartBridge Partners
    Austin TX
    5124191444x112
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  • 15.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-14-2019 13:35
    ​My reasons why - may not be valid for everyone:
    1. Sage Alerts and Workflow is a Sage branded offering, so to a certain extent they stand behind it and ultimately are responsible for the integration and support of the function. This is critical if something goes wrong.
    2. When a module such as Alerts and Workflow works fine, I don't want to second guess Sage. They reviewed it in detail and decided it would work well with the ERP, which it does.
    2. It is easy to sell. Many customers will opt for it over anything else simply because it has the Sage name attached to it. I know we in the channel can be critical of Sage, but for the most part the customers are very loyal.
    3. Alerts and Workflow includes the standard alerts and is not that difficult to use and customize/add new alerts.
    4. There are always going to be alternatives to the standard offerings that will save money, but ongoing support is required by the partner. I have reviewed potential customers that have numerous add-ons that are not standard offerings, and as a new consultant there would be a learning curve to support them. That's not free for the customer, so ultimately what is the long-term cost?

    I have never seen Visual Cut, but I believe there is a session on this at MOTM. As for the one person support, see Jerry's comment on the required sale of VSoft. That's a risk.

    BPA is more complex and a larger investment. If the customer has multiple customization needs where it may be used, then it probably makes more sense. Otherwise, if it is just alerts that are required, it may not be worth the investment.

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    John Hoyt
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  • 16.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-14-2019 13:51
    I find A&W to be a behemoth of complexity for what it does (how many admin programs do you need to manage automated alerts?!?), and I cannot contact support because I have not gone through their certification.
    Visual Cut has a very low learning curve, with very powerful features, and a simple / effective UI.  Text file logs (emails / errors), instead of a maze of screens to even find that there is an error message somewhere.
    I will admit that VC being (seemingly) a one-man-show can be concerning for long term stability, but with every contact I have nothing but a positive impression of Ido.

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    Kevin Moyes
    Technical Systems Analyst, Munjal-White Consulting
    Toronto ON
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  • 17.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-14-2019 14:12
    What Kevin said. Plus I find that customers are increasingly (but not always) turning to me to tell them what to buy. Doesn't happen this way all the time but I'd say for customers where I have a consulting relationship that 85% of them will ask what to buy with the other 15% buying based on the recommendation of a friend or webinar they attended.

    No matter what they buy we have to make sure not to paint ourselves into the corner of the unpaid warranty department. I try to stress this to customers but they hear what they want to hear and if something isn't working it's often our neck to strangle even if we have little/no control.

    Sage backing an endorsed solution doesn't give me more confidence any longer. I could rattle off several recent endorsed interactions (Avalara being one) that were not pleasant.

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    Wayne Schulz
    Schulz Consulting - Consultant
    Glastonbury CT
    860-516-8990
    http://www.s-consult.com
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  • 18.  RE: Why would someone buy Alerts & Workflow vs Visual Cut

    Posted 01-15-2019 12:47
    Has anyone tried using Microsoft Flow with Sage data to generate alerts, etc?
    That would be an industry standard product with lots of support and low initial investment, maybe...

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    Clark Walliser
    Senior Consultant
    San Jose CA
    Clark
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