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Sage Issues OAuth Update

  • 1.  Sage Issues OAuth Update

    Posted 09-12-2022 16:50


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    Wayne Schulz
    wayne@s-consult.com
    Schulz Consulting
    (860) 516-8990
    Moodus, CT
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  • 2.  RE: Sage Issues OAuth Update

    Posted 09-12-2022 17:03
    Just had a discussion with a client using O365 this afternoon and told her the info was changing all the time and if she asked me next week, it may all be different.

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    Beth Bowers
    (269) 358-0989
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  • 3.  RE: Sage Issues OAuth Update

    Posted 09-12-2022 17:08
    This makes us and Sage look really technically competent: sending news far and wide that the sky is falling... only to later have to say: uhhhh... just kidding?

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    Kevin Moyes
    Technical Systems Analyst
    Munjal White Consulting Co.
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  • 4.  RE: Sage Issues OAuth Update

    Posted 09-12-2022 18:47
    Does this mean that TLS/STARTTLS will still work after 10/1/2022?

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    Doug Higgs
    Midwest Commerce Solutions, Inc
    (312) 315-0960
    Chauffeur, Chef, and Personal Assistant to Sprinkles
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  • 5.  RE: Sage Issues OAuth Update

    Posted 09-13-2022 08:24
    Wasn't MS's decommissioning of SMTP announced quite some time ago? If so, it looks sort of like Sage waiting for the last minute for all this?

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    Jerry Norman
    At-Large BOD Member, 90 Minds
    Smartbridge Partners
    (512) 653-7498
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  • 6.  RE: Sage Issues OAuth Update

    Posted 09-13-2022 09:05

    OAuth has been discussed and delayed by both Google and Microsoft.
    I'm not an expert in this area.

    I followed Sage's lead expecting they analyzed and knew what protocol was needed.

    I think Microsoft started making plans for OAuth prior to Covid.

    I believe the article that Sage is referencing is this one dated September 9, 2022 from Microsoft.

    I do not think this is new information however Microsoft has issued several updates regarding Oauth and none of them went out of their way to be especially clear about exactly which type of user would be impacted.

    In September 2021 Microsoft was talking about NOT disabling SMTP AUTH here.

    via their 9/2021 FAQ above 

    I thought you said you were not going to completely disable SMTP AUTH?
    You're right, we did, in blog posts here and here. We're going to continue to disable SMTP AUTH for tenants who don't use it, but we will not be changing the configuration of any tenant who does. We can't tell though if the usage we see is valid or not, that's down to you to determine. So you still should move away from using Basic and SMTP AUTH though if you can, as it does leave you exposed. Don't forget, you can disable it at the tenant level, and re-enable on a per-user/account level as described here.

    So far as I can tell --- and I'm NOT AN EXPERT --- it appears that SMTP AUTH is what most/all Sage users were using prior to the OAuth capabilities being added to Sage 100 in 2020.6, 2021.4, 2022.1+.

    Updates, correction and browbeating welcomed for the above info



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    Wayne Schulz
    wayne@s-consult.com
    Schulz Consulting
    (860) 516-8990
    Moodus, CT
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  • 7.  RE: Sage Issues OAuth Update

    Posted 09-13-2022 09:35
    Thanks for the details. It's clearly complicated. 
    I asked because this was the comment I got from a customer's IT firm. Regardless of truth, it makes Sage look dumb to outside observers. Too bad.

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    Jerry Norman
    At-Large BOD Member, 90 Minds
    Smartbridge Partners
    (512) 653-7498
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  • 8.  RE: Sage Issues OAuth Update

    Posted 09-13-2022 10:37
    Clearly mishandled.  The Sage developers were likely given a technical problem: fix OAuth with O365, which they have done.  What was missed before all the promotion around the M$ changes is a detailed review of what products were affected (in consultation with M$).
    The cynical side of me suspects someone at Sage saw an opportunity to get users back on plan / upgraded to currently supported versions, and consciously chose not to look deeper into the technical side of things.
    I trusted Sage to have done this already, and (as Wayne said) followed their lead in communicating recommendations.  At the time the news broke, I checked with Ido about Visual Cut, and his answer made me suspect he might be wrong... but it turns out Ido's reply was the correct one (and applicable to Paperless email too).
    Sad.

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    Kevin Moyes
    Technical Systems Analyst
    Munjal White Consulting Co.
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  • 9.  RE: Sage Issues OAuth Update

    Posted 09-14-2022 11:59
    My personal opinion is that this is on Microsoft, not Sage.  Our sister IT company alerted us to this issue last year, and the notice they received from MS was more of a "make this change or suffer the consequences" type notice.  Clearly, MS wants to eliminate basic authentication because of the inherent security risks of a simple login with a password.  I think MS could have made their messaging much more clear, but they didn't.  The issue is still one of risk even though there may not be an Oct 1 deadline.  My role is not to question MS or Sage when it comes to important or urgent notices that relates to their respective products.  At the end of the day, it doesn't change the fact that businesses running older versions of technology expose themselves to unnecessary risks and a little scare every now and then is a good reminder.

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    Brian Kelly
    Accounting Systems, Inc. (ASI)
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  • 10.  RE: Sage Issues OAuth Update

    Posted 09-14-2022 12:23
    Microsoft is certainly not uninvolved, but they did include the exclusion / change details in their announcements.  I don't blame them for using strong language because it is a big deal for the affected systems.
    Sage didn't perform their due diligence when interpreting the potential impact of the pending M$ changes, with Sage knowing exactly how Sage software is programmed to function.
    There is a difference in these two messages:
    • Microsoft is locking down their services in a way that will break Paperless email functionality in Sage 100.
    • Microsoft is locking down their services with enhanced security, and we want to help you make your systems more secure too.
    The first turns out to be false, if Sage had taken the time to check first, but that is the message they sent out... for more than a month. 
    The second line is the truth, clear, and reasonable, with the adversary being cyber crime, not Microsoft security changes.  This is what they are changing their tune to now, but should have been the message from the start.

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    Kevin Moyes
    Technical Systems Analyst
    Munjal White Consulting Co.
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  • 11.  RE: Sage Issues OAuth Update

    Posted 09-14-2022 12:37
    All that is true, but Sage cannot possibly know what customers are using for email.  Here is the MS message from the 9/9/2022 post:

    "We're removing the ability to use Basic authentication in Exchange Online for Exchange ActiveSync (EAS), POP, IMAP, Remote PowerShell, Exchange Web Services (EWS), Offline Address Book (OAB), Outlook for Windows, and Mac. 

    We're also disabling SMTP AUTH in all tenants in which it's not being used.

    This decision requires customers to move from apps that use basic authentication to apps that use Modern authentication...."

    Yes, Sage could have also put out a much more confusing message of, "you may be fine, but maybe not."  I'm just saying it appears to me that Sage took the most appropriate action and assumed things are going to stop working on 10/1.

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    Brian Kelly
    Accounting Systems, Inc. (ASI)
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  • 12.  RE: Sage Issues OAuth Update

    Posted 09-14-2022 12:53
    Sage doesn't know what email providers are used by their customers, but they know how their software connects with email servers.

    I asked Ido (developer of Visual Cut) and knowing how his email programming worked, he almost immediately sent me this reply (in July), after clarifying VC email will be fine:
    I assumed (since Sage was not saying the same thing) that Sage 100 didn't use this method of authentication.

    Sage waited until... last week... to check on the impact of the M$ changes to their software, with the above text (about SMTP AUTH not being depreciated) in the original July announcement.  That is nobody's fault but Sage's.

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    Kevin Moyes
    Technical Systems Analyst
    Munjal White Consulting Co.
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  • 13.  RE: Sage Issues OAuth Update

    Posted 09-14-2022 13:15

    The Q&A from the Aug 30 2022 TLS/OAuth webinar - which are now available in Sage Partner Hub - started me thinking the issue might not be as broad as Sage made it out to be.

    There were several instances such as when a customer was self-hosting Exchange that the OAuth issue did not apply ( or at least that was the answer ).

    Should Sage have handles this better? Probably.

    They pushed out several rounds of FAQ and held a webinar on the topic so there definitely was a lot of light shining on the issue.

    My recommendation to customers is staying the same - you want to be on 2022.x if at all possible. If you can't get to 2022 get to 2021.

    If you're hung at an older version due to some third-party solution then  you just made a bad life choice of ISV. Period. 



    There is 0.00% incentive to make Sage 100 an easy upgrade because doing so removes incentive to move to the cloud where upgrades happen seamlessly.




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    Wayne Schulz
    wayne@s-consult.com
    Schulz Consulting
    (860) 516-8990
    Moodus, CT
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  • 14.  RE: Sage Issues OAuth Update

    Posted 11-01-2022 12:12
    So it has been six plus weeks since the last post.  Did this turn out to be an issue of "the sky is falling" or "Much Ado about Nothing"?  Do I lose sleep over not having clients current with the latest and greatest Sage releases?

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    Jeff Schwenk
    Bottomline Software, Inc.
    (540) 221-4444
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  • 15.  RE: Sage Issues OAuth Update

    Posted 11-01-2022 13:16
    I haven't taken any calls on this.
    I've suggested to customers (repeatedly) that they upgrade to the latest version to stay compatible. I didn't see anything in 2023 that's going to really drive upgrades unless the customer is on Production Management.

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    Wayne Schulz
    wayne@s-consult.com
    https://www.schulzsays.com/
    Schulz Consulting
    (860) 516-8990
    Moodus, CT
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  • 16.  RE: Sage Issues OAuth Update

    Posted 11-01-2022 20:55
    Edited by Kevin Moyes 11-01-2022 20:56
    OAuth was much-ado-about-nothing.
    Older versions will become read-only next fall if not compatible with TLS 1.2... due to Sage locking down their licensing service.

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    Kevin Moyes
    Technical Systems Analyst
    Munjal White Consulting Co.
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